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And I have been happy to meet them and pleased to welcome them. Chairman Leahy. As my last question, in some of the statement this morning there has been an idea that, of training course, just with all the hundreds of billions, trillions of bucks all set to spend, you ought to simply go somewhere else.

Stenger. I would certainly inform you that in this climate the capacity to raise funding for the points we are doing would certainly have-- it is difficult to do so in a way that would enable us as properly and as quickly produce the important things we have actually done. You can obtain money if you have got half down.

I might have borrowed half of that if I had the $12 million in money to place up. Everybody understands that, yes, banks have money to financing as long as you have actually obtained half of it in your pocket prior to you ask for the various other fifty percent. That is not just how business functions these days.

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Senator Grassley. Legislator Grassley. I desire to admit that we just have anecdotal info, however I would like to ask you to what level you have to go or do go to make sure that the facilities make sure that the investments do not create jobs for people right here unlawfully.

Mr. Stenger. We have worked with-- as I claimed, at the Optimal we had 550 construction workers on our job.

They are composed of 10, 15, 20, 30 employees. They are from our local regions. They are Vermonters. They are profiting straight from the investment. We are a hands-on center. I recognize the employees, I recognize their family members, and we have actually had the ability to employ-- with these last 3 years of terrible financial turmoil, we have actually had the ability to utilize practically every building and construction employee in our area and the surrounding areas.

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locals. They stay in the location. Their family members exist. They are purchased the communities, and they are all united state employees. Legislator Grassley. You do not have to use e-verify, but I wish to know whether or not you do. Mr. Stenger. We do. Legislator Grassley. You do.

Thanks. Mr. North, along the same lines of the question I asked him, has your study revealed instances various other-- and I just gave one instance, so I wish to admit that and be liable about it-- of centers working with undocumented individuals? Mr. North. That sort of data is extremely tough to get from USCIS, and I should claim that what we do find out about most of the internal points about that check here company regarding this program is worried associates with instances in which the personnel has claimed no to an application of some kind and then the local facility or the individual entrepreneur has mosted likely to the Administrative Appeals Workplace-- which becomes part of the agency-- and there we obtain records, we obtain a hearing police officer telling us what is going on because particular situation.



This is a poor application." So there is a quantity of negative applications available, however only when that process obtains prior to a management legislation court do we see a lot in the means of information. Now, there was one case that you pointed out, and allow me simply elaborate on that particular a little.

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Do not take also long since I intend to ask an additional pair questions. But proceed and swiftly coating. Mr. North. The dairy farm had actually claimed 17 employees, and they got into it, and the court located that 16 of them were illegals. Currently, that is the one instance I have, and it is a great instance.

Okay. I am mosting likely to ask different inquiries of each of the 3 of you, yet it takes care of this set problem. As I stated in my opening statement, I am concerned concerning the prospective loophole that allows investors to withdraw their investment in local facilities after obtaining their permit.

Divine, are you aware of any type of circumstances in which a financier took out the investment and left promptly after getting a permit? And if you are, or if you think it is an issue, do you assume that it is a loophole that should be closed? Mr. Divine. I would certainly state that a lot of the financiers, if you asked them what are their goals, they would certainly claim, "I intend to obtain a permit, and I wish to maintain it.

Mr. Divine. Let me ask Mr. Stenger, is it usual for an investor in your experience to withdraw his or her investment right away after receiving a copyright? Mr.

Senator, legislator.

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